Wow you guys really made me think with the response to my faith topic, I was just arguing with a friend today over Israel and invading Lebabon and he quoted all the bible scriptures to me trying to show me that, Israel were the chosen people of God and how God allowed them to go in and slaughter the Canninties (first recorded insident of Genocide) including killing small children, and I asked is that what Christ Jesus died for so God could order the slaughter of babies for the Jews? So you are saying that not only is God a racist, but not a God of love as well? If God created all of us from the dust why would he love one race more than another? And all he could say well because the Bible says so and I said well that's "BULLSHIT!" He went on to say the killing of civilians was justified because Israel is the chosen people so everything they do is justified, so it made me realize the Christians outside of the WTS could be as F-ED up as the ones within it. Maybe the Wild beast will turn on the Whore of Babylon, making the nations drunk on her slaughter, Get out her the bible says; maybe it was a subtle self-indictment about not clinging too tightly to any one truth, or orginization for that matter. Existence itself is a miracle and self-evident proof of a creator, maybe we have to find him within ourselves.
Silvia Plath
JoinedPosts by Silvia Plath
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Lebanon and Israel
by Silvia Plath inwow you guys really made me think with the response to my faith topic, i was just arguing with a friend today over israel and invading lebabon and he quoted all the bible scriptures to me trying to show me that, israel were the chosen people of god and how god allowed them to go in and slaughter the canninties (first recorded insident of genocide) including killing small children, and i asked is that what christ jesus died for so god could order the slaughter of babies for the jews?
so you are saying that not only is god a racist, but not a god of love as well?
if god created all of us from the dust why would he love one race more than another?
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Has being a Jehova's witness totally shattered your faith?
by Silvia Plath injust because the watchtower society is wrong doesn't mean that there is no god, nor does it mean there is a god.
it would interesting to now how former members have adjusted thier cosmology, or whether they are now atheists and why.
i personally see religion as a more personal matter, rather than belonging to an organization.
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Silvia Plath
Just because the watchtower society is wrong doesn't mean that there is no God, nor does it mean there is a God. It would interesting to now how former members have adjusted thier cosmology, or whether they are now atheists and why. I personally see religion as a more personal matter, rather than belonging to an organization. My relationship with YHWH is private and uniquely individual, it is a relief not to have it approved through a GB, nor do I feel the need to "convert" anyone else. What they believe is thier business, besides people learn through actions, not brainwashing. By the way has anyone seen this film lambasting the WTS from 1984?
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Is Prince Still a Jehova's Witness?
by Silvia Plath in.
has anyone heard of what happened with prince being a jehova's witness if he still is or not?
and how is he pursuing his music career while doing it?
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Silvia Plath
Has anyone heard of what happened with Prince being a Jehova's Witness if he still is or not? And how is he pursuing his music career while doing it?
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Have any of you been to e-watchman?
by Silvia Plath inhttp://www.e-watchman.com/.
this site is also made up of many ex and current jw's, the difference is they all remain deeply committed to christianity and bible study, but are extremely distrustful of the watch tower orginanization and consider it to be a "pharisee" or a "false prophet" what the bible warns of.
from what i am reading they seem to be the beginning movements of a break away sect, many of them praise russell who seems to have been more spiritual and laid back and trace the demise of the movement with rutherford, who began introducing all the messed up rules they have now.
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Silvia Plath
I think it's okay to believe in the bible or not believe in it, whatever floats your boat, I believe in the bible but I had a problem with telling other people what they should believe since I am not them, that was my problem with door to door, not every belief system works for every person. This one size fits all approach to spirituality the JW's had was too simplistic for me.
When I told Carol that leaving my bible study had nothing to do with how I felt about Jehovah, she didn't understand. It could be that they are having problems letting go of thier doctrine even though they now mistrust thier organization. I guess I still believe in God because his presence is self-evident in the nature of existence itsself, much for the same reason Thomas Aquinas did. I can't let a cult destroy that, still it was interesting reading that site, because its been about a hundred years and it looks as if they are having thier own mini "protestant reformation" going on! It's kind of funny if you think about, the organization is turning on itself. LIke you said that site might be the gateway to this one, where they question a bit and then move on.
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Have any of you been to e-watchman?
by Silvia Plath inhttp://www.e-watchman.com/.
this site is also made up of many ex and current jw's, the difference is they all remain deeply committed to christianity and bible study, but are extremely distrustful of the watch tower orginanization and consider it to be a "pharisee" or a "false prophet" what the bible warns of.
from what i am reading they seem to be the beginning movements of a break away sect, many of them praise russell who seems to have been more spiritual and laid back and trace the demise of the movement with rutherford, who began introducing all the messed up rules they have now.
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Silvia Plath
this site is also made up of many ex and CURRENT JW's, the difference is they all remain deeply committed to Christianity and bible study, but are extremely distrustful of the Watch tower orginanization and consider it to be a "pharisee" or a "false prophet" what the bible warns of. From what I am reading they seem to be the beginning movements of a break away sect, many of them praise Russell who seems to have been more spiritual and laid back and trace the demise of the movement with Rutherford, who began introducing all the messed up rules they have now. At least that's what I'm getting out of it. Imagine if this movement had the same message without the holiday restictions, or having to go to 3 meetings a week, being able to determine your own education, or such scrutiny over your life? They keep talking about how Christ said his burden was "light" but the Watchtowers burden is "heavy" . They have the same wierd artwork though, like the publications, its kind of surreal....It's almost as if they trying to get together and plan rebellion against the main governing body.
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Recently Studied With JW's--need help breaking up
by Silvia Plath ini studied with the jw's for two years and some time this coming week i will be making the "phone call" to tell carol my friend, that i do not want to study any longer with the jw's.
i don't know why i let them into my kitchen to begin with, except there was something about her and i don't make friends well with other women, most of my friends are guys, but carol could tell a irish yarn that made you laugh and feel good.
she made me feel safe and she was fun to go shopping with and talk about problems too, she was like the mother i never had.
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Silvia Plath
thanks everyone for your wonderful support! I spoke to Carol today and she steadfastly beleives in what she is doing and still thinks I will come around and as much as it pains me, I can't live a lie. I can't believe I almost fell for the classic cult swindle, and they used my own belief in a creator against me. I read the posts where people died during meetings and the meetings kept going, if the principal characteristic of a witness is love, then how could they do that? They love obediance to an organization, not to God. if they followed Ja who is love , they would think of a the hurting human being before them rather than complete obediance to the ORG. Its more like fascism than Christianity.
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How is the cult structure of JW's similar to that of Scientology?
by Silvia Plath inafter what happened to me and how i almost joined thinking i must not be as intelligent as i thought i was if i really belived this tripe, i started researching other cults.. this site which is dedicated to exposing scientology www.xenu.net , it relayed how many people who were in the cult for decades were, doctors, lawyers, even a physicist!
it says if you get hooked it is not because you are stupid or naive that is the nature of mind control.
in the auditing sessions they use mind numbing "repitition" of certain things, similar to how my teacher would keep asking me "who is ruler of this world" satan, satan, i would keep replying, mind you;.
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Silvia Plath
After what happened to me and how I almost joined thinking I must not be as intelligent as I thought I was if I really belived this tripe, I started researching other cults.
This site which is dedicated to exposing scientology www.xenu.net , it relayed how many people who were in the cult for decades were, doctors, lawyers, even a physicist!
It says if you get hooked it is not because you are stupid or naive that is the nature of mind control. In the auditing sessions they use mind numbing "repitition" of certain things, similar to how my teacher would keep asking me "who is ruler of this world" satan, satan, I would keep replying, mind you;
my international version does say Satan rules the world at this time, but wether it's true or not at this point is irrelevant, after so many repititons it would be like mind altering brain washing. Its one thing to believe Satan is ruler of this world after careful study of scriptures and observation of verifiable data, backed up by personal belief, it is quite another to have it programmed in your brain by someone else. One could argue that the organization is disserving the bible and Ja by programming people; something God himself has refused to do by giving us free will and a complex brain. He wanted us to come to enlightenment through undesrtanding, not milaitirization of the mind and personality. They put themselves in the place of God, now that is apostacy.
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Not a part of this world..ain't that the truth!
by Virgochik inwhen jw's say they are no part of this world, i have to wonder if they know just how true that is.
if they could see themselves as others see them, carrying the scripture to the ridiculous extremes that some do.
for example, i had a recent conversation with (left un-named fro security reasons) elderly relatives.
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Silvia Plath
I don't know that is the part that appealed to me about the JW's, thier seeming lack of materialism. Henry David Thoreau spoke of modern man being "a tool of his tools", and he spoke of the "innoscent savage" haven't you noticed how hung up people are on thier cars and cellphones, to where having those things becomes more important than living? Is there not a one of us that have romaticized about the simple living of early native americans or of the ancient Greeks speaking philosophy around a public bath? That's why they are able to hook "the outsiders" like me, people who sneer at the abject celluliod existence perpetrated from the glossy magazines and vapid Tv. Ads. When I was studying it was like my life seemed simpler, cleaner, but I should have known the truth was not that pre-packaged, or formulaic. I still don't want to be a part of this world, but I definitely don't want to be a JW either. I think technology can be good, as long as people still have the ability to connect with nature when the need arises and to work with Nature rather than against it. Technology has led to global warming...think about that.
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Recently Studied With JW's--need help breaking up
by Silvia Plath ini studied with the jw's for two years and some time this coming week i will be making the "phone call" to tell carol my friend, that i do not want to study any longer with the jw's.
i don't know why i let them into my kitchen to begin with, except there was something about her and i don't make friends well with other women, most of my friends are guys, but carol could tell a irish yarn that made you laugh and feel good.
she made me feel safe and she was fun to go shopping with and talk about problems too, she was like the mother i never had.
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Silvia Plath
Thank you everyone for your support, I will be making the phone call tommorow. Hearing about your experiences has made me less afraid to be human. Lately I felt guilty that I did not want to give up my buddha statues that I collect, and I was told as an artist I would have to change the things I like to paint, or stop doing poetry readings in coffee houses, or give up my punk band. If Ja made me who I am, then he would appreciate my gifts and want me to use them.
I will try to maintain my friendship with Carl, for she is a creative talented grpahic designer and we have alot in common.
Also I had no idea they legislate what you do in the bedroom. I still think the bible is inspired and believe in a God of Love, but I don't believe the watchtower owns the "truth" anymore
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Recently Studied With JW's--need help breaking up
by Silvia Plath ini studied with the jw's for two years and some time this coming week i will be making the "phone call" to tell carol my friend, that i do not want to study any longer with the jw's.
i don't know why i let them into my kitchen to begin with, except there was something about her and i don't make friends well with other women, most of my friends are guys, but carol could tell a irish yarn that made you laugh and feel good.
she made me feel safe and she was fun to go shopping with and talk about problems too, she was like the mother i never had.
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Silvia Plath
I studied with the JW's for two years and some time this coming week I will be making the "phone call" to tell Carol my friend, that I do not want to study any longer with the JW's. I don't know why I let them into my kitchen to begin with, except there was something about her and I don't make friends well with other women, most of my friends are guys, but Carol could tell a Irish yarn that made you laugh and feel good. She made me feel safe and she was fun to go shopping with and talk about problems too, she was like the mother I never had. As a child I had a strong belief in the creator and felt Yahweh had a purpose and plan for me and that I was his special and loved child, and I won't let an orginization separate me from him. But as we studied it became less and less about doing what pleases Ja, and more and more about obediance to the Organization. That I didn't equate obediance to the organization as loving Jehovah, showed I was not making progress according to Carol. She went home for a month when her mother died dropped back into drinking and when she came back she was not allowed to talk at meetings until it was felt she progressed. She was baker acted during this time and put into a hosipital for observation, she was eventually allowed to come back into the fold but changed congregations. Still she pressured me to make a greater commitment, but I felt more and more she needed help getting out. Three meetings a week is not feasible when you are homeschooling a child, she said I should pray about it.There is no praying to be made, I have a life as an artist and mother and Jehovah wants me to live it, instead of slaving for a secretive corrupt billion dollar orginization, which pretends to be the prophet and instrument of God. Perhaps The Watchtower is the very Chistendom of mammon they preach against, they disguise themselves that way. I do think I benefitted from study and learned better how to pray and read the bible, but I cannot continue any longer with such a totalitarian structure, any suggestions on how letting my friend know it is not her, but the orginization I am rejecting? I very much care about her feelings...........